Re: metastock-digest V1 #1385

["Lionel Issen" <lissen@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Schalk:
You are not asking dumb questions, you are asking questions for information.
Look at R-square and linear regression slope.
Lionel Issen
lissen@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
----- Original Message -----
From: "Schalk Pienaar (HO)" <schalkp@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2001 1:50 AM
Subject: RE: metastock-digest V1 #1385


> Greetings from South Africa
>
> I am new to this newsletter and to charting and to Metastock. I got hold
of
> a version 6.52 just to see if I am compatable to this business and would
ask
> a lot of dumb questions in the hope that you experts will be able to give
> good advice.
>
> The first thing I want to know is how to write an indicator that can give
> the gradient of a share over a spesified previous period e.g. gradient of
a
> line drawn from the closing price 20 days ago to the closing price today?
>
> Can anybody help - please?
>
> Regards
>
> Schalk Pienaar
> Manager Capital Investment Process
> AngloPlatinum Corporation
> schalkp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Tel:  (011) 373-6410
> Fax: (011) 373-5410
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-metastock-digest@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:owner-metastock-digest@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: 13 July 2001 12:50
> To: metastock-digest@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: metastock-digest V1 #1385
>
>
>
> metastock-digest        Friday, July 13 2001        Volume 01 : Number
1385
>
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 11:25:41 -0700
> From: "Glen Wallace" <gcwallace@xxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: TradeStation
>
> > How is TradeStation superior? From what I have heard, many are
> > unhappy with TradeStation due to the poor support, difficulty with
> > "Easy Language", and moving to an online platform.
>
> Others here can comment more knowledgeably than I, but the key
> factor for me is the programming language itself  --  it's more powerful
> and flexible.  Chuck LeBeau's chandelier exit, for example, is five lines
> of EasyLanguage code, whereas my equivalent in MetaStock is 12
> lines with a bunch of nested PREV statements.  Don't get me wrong,
> though; I think MetaStock is the superior application overall and
> Equis is the better company to work with.
>
>
>
>
> - ----- Original Message -----
> From: "neo" <neo1@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2001 10:20 AM
> Subject: TradeStation
>
> > Glen
> >
> > No one else demonstrated it but when I called support they confirmed the
> > problem. It was my mistake and theirs.
> >
> > How is TradeStation superior? From what I have heard, many are unhappy
> with
> > TradeStation due to the poor support, difficulty with "Easy Language",
and
> > moving to an online platform.
> >
> > neo
> >
> >
> > ~  -----Original Message-----
> > ~  From: owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > ~  [mailto:owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Glen Wallace
> > ~  Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2001 11:44 AM
> > ~  To: MetaStock listserver
> > ~  Subject: Re: System Tester
> > ~
> > ~  I was simply unable to duplicate the System Tester errors
> > ~  you noted last week.  Was anyone else able to duplicate it?
> > ~
> > ~  For more advanced system testing, TradeStation is the
> > ~  standard.
> > ~
> > ~
> > ~
> > ~  ----- Original Message -----
> > ~  From: neo
> > ~  To: metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > ~  Sent: Monday, July 09, 2001 5:11 PM
> > ~  Subject: System Tester
> > ~
> > ~  Because of the major flaws in MetaStock's System Tester,
> > ~  does anyone know of another System Tester Program that
> > ~  will work with MetaStock data and hopefully use the same
> > ~  programming language?
> > ~
> > ~  neo
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 16:59:53 -0400
> X-Sybari-Trust: de5d64fe 050014dd 00000000 00000000
> From: "Norman" <cutup2@xxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: TradeStation
>
> Neo   Last month at the SIA show in NYC, I saw a demo of the new Trade
> Station Institutional platform. They said the release was to be late
> summer. It will be leased and Trade Station Securities will clear
> through Bear Sterns. The program includes extended hours, commission
> recapture, automatic direction of orders  and a quote "trading desk to
> maximize the value of our products and services" etc. Back tests can
> be made on the spot while trading before placing an order.
> Norm Wiss
> cutup2@xxxxxxxx
> - ----- Original Message -----
> From: "neo" <neo1@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2001 1:20 PM
> Subject: TradeStation
>
>
> > Glen
> >
> > No one else demonstrated it but when I called support they confirmed
> the
> > problem. It was my mistake and theirs.
> >
> > How is TradeStation superior? From what I have heard, many are
> unhappy with
> > TradeStation due to the poor support, difficulty with "Easy
> Language", and
> > moving to an online platform.
> >
> > neo
> >
> >
> > ~  -----Original Message-----
> > ~  From: owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > ~  [mailto:owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Glen Wallace
> > ~  Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2001 11:44 AM
> > ~  To: MetaStock listserver
> > ~  Subject: Re: System Tester
> > ~
> > ~
> > ~  I was simply unable to duplicate the System Tester errors
> > ~  you noted last week.  Was anyone else able to duplicate it?
> > ~
> > ~  For more advanced system testing, TradeStation is the
> > ~  standard.
> > ~
> > ~
> > ~
> > ~  ----- Original Message -----
> > ~  From: neo
> > ~  To: metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > ~  Sent: Monday, July 09, 2001 5:11 PM
> > ~  Subject: System Tester
> > ~
> > ~  Because of the major flaws in MetaStock's System Tester,
> > ~  does anyone know of another System Tester Program that
> > ~  will work with MetaStock data and hopefully use the same
> > ~  programming language?
> > ~
> > ~  neo
> > ~
> > ~
> >
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 16:16:18 -0700
> From: Murat Kuntel <mkuntel@xxxxxxxx>
> Subject: A System
>
> Hello folks,
>
> I tried quite a bit today and could not formulate a system in Metastock
> formula.    In one hand I don't understand some of the syntax as well as
> some of you, on the other hand there is something wrong in my PC, I even
> could not replace my default template with a different one.  In any case,
> here is what I wanted to do.  I want to try a system which buys when
> Bressert's Cycles indicator (5) unit bottoms, makes a trough while MACD or
> a slow Stoch for example (30,13,10) is rising, that is one of the two
> between these trend showing indicators is rising.  The system would close
> the trade when the Cycles (5) peaks.  For the short side I was going to
> reverse it, but if anyone can help me with the long side, I can modify it
> for the short side.  I actually wanted to close the trade with a displaced
> moving average and that does not appear to my eyes in the formula
> language.  For example exit when Close goes underneath 10 unit Moving
> Average displaced 7 bars.  Any help will be appreciated.
>
> Murat
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 20:39:02 -0700
> From: "Sean Taylor" <cloudnine@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: RE: Daily/Weekly/Monthly charts
>
> Thanks very much for your help.
>
> I was thinking of including Weekly results with Daily as part of a system.
> That means translating daily into weekly OR accessing weekly data.
> Now I know I can't access weekly AND daily at the same time in the
explorer
> or an indicator so... I was thinking of getting the dev kit just to code a
> simple SECURITY function.  If you haven't gathered I'm using the EOD
> version.
> Now if it were just daily and weekly data, it probably would be easier to
do
> the translation in Metastock language but...I'm extremely keen to include
> intermarket relationships.  I just can't see how to do that without a
> SECURITY function.  If anybody else can, please let me know.
> As for a function to access any security, I'll post it to the list if/when
I
> get there.
> Thanks,
> Sean
>
> - -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Lionel Issen
> Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2001 7:58 AM
> To: metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: Daily/Weekly/Monthly charts
>
>
> In Metastock its the last Mon thru Fri.  It is not a running 5 day week.
> Lionel Issen
> lissen@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> - ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Sean Taylor" <cloudnine@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Monday, July 09, 2001 11:10 PM
> Subject: RE: Daily/Weekly/Monthly charts
>
>
> > Anybody know how weekly data is calculated from daily?
> > Is it the mean of the last complete week (i.e. M-F)? implying no value
> until
> > the Friday's closing prices are in!
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Sean
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > [mailto:owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of kevin miles
> > Sent: Friday, July 06, 2001 9:55 PM
> > To: metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: Re: Daily/Weekly/Monthly charts
> >
> >
> > Sean,
> >
> > as far as i know, there should be no practical difference between a),
and
> > b), other than you are collecting more data.
> >
> > as far as i am concerned,  daily data (and using the "change periods"
> > option) should be just fine.
> >
> > best wishes.
> >
> > kevin
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Sean Taylor" <cloudnine@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > To: "Metastock List" <metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2001 12:18 AM
> > Subject: Daily/Weekly/Monthly charts
> >
> >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > Can anybody tell me what the difference is between
> > > a) downloading daily data and selecting the display to be
> > > Daily/Weekly/Monthly
> > > b) downloading Daily/Weekly/Monthly data charts i.e. 3 different
charts.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Sean
> > >
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 09:20:07 -0400
> From: "neo" <neo1@xxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: PREV function
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> - ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C109EA.AD440D40
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> charset="Windows-1252"
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>
> I have been using MS Pro for over 1 1/2 years and I do not
> understand the PREV function. It is not well explained in either
> the manual or the help file. How does it differ from Ref(X,-1)?
>
> I am trying to have a formula determine if I am long or short.
>
> Any help?
>
> neo
>
> - ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C109EA.AD440D40
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> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
> <HTML><HEAD>
> <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
> charset=3Dwindows-1252">
> <META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4616.200" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
> <BODY>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#008080 size=3D4><SPAN =
> class=3D590551513-11072001>I have=20
> been using MS Pro for over 1 1/2 years and I do not understand the PREV=20
> function. It is not well explained in either the manual or the help =
> file. How=20
> does it differ from Ref(X,-1)?</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#008080 size=3D4><SPAN=20
> class=3D590551513-11072001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#008080 size=3D4><SPAN =
> class=3D590551513-11072001>I am=20
> trying to have a formula determine if I am long or =
> short.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#008080 size=3D4><SPAN=20
> class=3D590551513-11072001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#008080 size=3D4><SPAN =
> class=3D590551513-11072001>Any=20
> help?</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#008080 size=3D4><SPAN=20
> class=3D590551513-11072001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#008080 size=3D4><SPAN=20
> class=3D590551513-11072001>neo</SPAN></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
>
> - ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C109EA.AD440D40--
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 07:04:35 +1200
> From: "Roy Larsen" <rlarsen@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: PREV function
>
> Neo
>
> Ref(X,-1) allows you to look at yesterdays (previous bar) value of an
> ALREADY DEFINED variable (X).
> Prev allows you to look at yesterdays value of the variable you are
> CURRENTLY CREATING, and use that
> value to determine or modify the value or status of the current day/bar.
> Hence the term "self
> referencing".
>
> Roy
>
> - ----- Original Message -----
> From: "neo" <neo1@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Thursday, 12 July 2001 01:20
> Subject: PREV function
>
>
> > I have been using MS Pro for over 1 1/2 years and I do not
> > understand the PREV function. It is not well explained in either
> > the manual or the help file. How does it differ from Ref(X,-1)?
> >
> > I am trying to have a formula determine if I am long or short.
> >
> > Any help?
> >
> > neo
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 13:18:24 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Dave Nadeau <dave_nadeau@xxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: PREV function
>
> Neo,
>
> PREV in Metastock is a hugely resource-intensive way of setting and
holding
> a variable in the
> formula language.
>
> Before I give an example and comparison with Ref(), I want to make sure
that
> it's clear how
> Metastock and most other programs will run code against any given chart.
> When a chart is "loaded"
> onto your screen, all of the OHLC values are held in an array as numbers.
> Operations on that
> array will progress from the lowest array position to the highest.
>
> Visually, this means your indicator or system or any other object you've
> created in Formula
> Language will be evaluated bar by bar, starting from the earliest loaded
bar
> (Bar=1)all the way to
> the latest, most recent bar (e.g. Bar=5000).  So it moves from left to
right
> across your chart.
>
> Let say you have an indicator that is usually zero.  When the conditions
for
> this indicator all
> line up, it becomes =1, then the next bar it's over and back to =0.  Let
say
> that this happens on
> Bar 5 of your chart.   Then your indicator is 0 on Bar 2, 0 on Bar 3, 0 on
> Bar 4, 1 on Bar 5, 0 on
> Bar 6, ....
>
> If you want to store this occurance of Indicator=1 in a variable, you have
> to use PREV.  Here's
> what happens when you use Ref(Signal,-1):
> Bar 2 shows Ref()=0, Bar 3 shows Ref()=0, Bar 4 shows Ref()=0, Bar 5 shows
> Ref()=0, Bar 6 shows
> Ref()=1, Bar 7 shows Ref()=0, Bar 8 shows Ref()=0,.....
>
> But you want Bar 7 and Bar 8 etc. to =1 also.
>
> To do that, you'd have to define a new variable and say that if Signal=0,
> then the new variable is
> equal to PREV, and if signal=1, then the new variable is equal to 1.  Run
> through this logic on
> Bars 2 through 8 and you'll see that on Bar 5 the new variable becomes 1,
> and on Bar 6, since the
> signal=0, the new variable is equal to it's previous value, which is 1,
and
> on and on...
>
> This new variable will stay =1 until you somehow "shut it off."
>
> With regards to your point about finding a formula to determine if you are
> long or short, you can
> build on this work above.  Suppose your Signal is your EnterLong
conditions.
> Your new variable
> will stay=1 until you shut it off.  You could shut it off by creating
> Signal2 which is your
> EnterShort signal.
>
> So now, you have a way to change the value of your new variable.  Let's
call
> your new variable
> your TradePosition.
>
> TradePosition:=If(EnterLong=1,1,If(EnterShort=1,-1,PREV),PREV);
>
> Now you can look at your TradePosition and if it =1 then you are long, and
> if it =-1 you are
> short.
>
> (I didn't check the syntax of the above Metastock expression, since I'm
not
> near my program right
> now.  I'm doing this all from memory--which ain't so great all the
> time....<grin>.)
>
> - -----WARNING!!!  The PREV function is a huge resource drain.  Try to
avoid
> its use wherever
> possible, especially in real time trading systems!!!!!-------------
>
> One workaround that's been discussed on this list is the following:
>
> TradePosition:=If(BarsSince(EnterLong)<=BarsSince(EnterShort),1,-1);
>
> is very similar to the above statement, but misses the first Long or Short
> trade, whichever
> happens first.
>
> - ------------------------------
>
> Neo, you recently asked about Tradestation and why it is considered the
> "standard."  In this
> example, Tradestation has a built in function called MarketPosition which
> does everything I've
> built up to above, so you can avoid all of the coding and logic, and just
> use
>
> {EasyLanguage example:  if you are long, apply a Chandelier Exit for a
> stoploss}
>
> If MarketPosition=1 then ExitLong MaxTradeHigh - (3 * AvgTrueRange(20))
> Stop;
>
> all in one statement which runs very quickly on a real time chart.
Compare
> this with some other
> recent posts of Metastock Formula Language solutions to the Chandelier
> Exit....
>
> Dave Nadeau
> Fort Collins, CO
>
> - --- neo <neo1@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > I have been using MS Pro for over 1 1/2 years and I do not
> > understand the PREV function. It is not well explained in either
> > the manual or the help file. How does it differ from Ref(X,-1)?
> >
> > I am trying to have a formula determine if I am long or short.
> >
> > Any help?
> >
> > neo
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
> http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 18:10:40 -0400
> From: Herman van den Bergen <psytek@xxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: PREV function
>
> At 01:18 PM 7/11/01 -0700, you wrote:
> >...TradePosition:=If(EnterLong=1,1,If(EnterShort=1,-1,PREV),PREV);
>
> One too many PREVs :-) but you've got a better memory than I would have
> without my computer!
> try:
>
> TradePosition:=If(EnterLong=1,1,If(EnterShort=1,-1,PREV));
>
> or:
>
> TradePosition:=If(EnterLong,1,If(EnterShort,-1,PREV));
>
> Happy trading
> Herman.
>
> >Now you can look at your TradePosition and if it =1 then you are long,
and
> if it =-1 you are
> >short.
> >
> >(I didn't check the syntax of the above Metastock expression, since I'm
> not near my program right
> >now.  I'm doing this all from memory--which ain't so great all the
> time....<grin>.)
> >...
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 17:10:42 +0800
> From: hcong <hcong@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Sytem Testing Question: Multiple Contracts
>
> Hi List Member,
>
> As far as I know, Metastock do not allow testing of multiple contracts
> in one single security.  I think (have not try yet) combining multiple
> testing report can get the same effect, but I am looking for easilier
> way.
>
> So the question here is: is there an easilier way?  What about amibroker
> and other alternative?
>
> Any advice is very much appreciated.
>
>
> - --
>
> Regards.
>
> Ong Hock Choon
> hcong@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 16:03:58 +0100
> From: leo.timmermans.lt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Sector analysis
>
> Hello,
>
> Does anybody know if the 10 major SP500 sector indices (utilities,
> telecommunications,...) have tickersymbols
> and can be downloaded from e.g. yahoo ??
>
> Kind regards
> Leo
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 08:09:26 -0700
> From: "Allan Wade" <allanwade@xxxxxxxx>
> Subject: RE: Sector analysis
>
> Hello Leo,
>
> Go to http://www.spglobal.com/indexmain1500_data.html
>
> This is a link to the S&P SuperComposite 1500 Index.
> You will see a link to download the S&P 1500 in Excel or CSV format. There
> is a lot of info there including what sector/industry the stock is part of
> (GICS). I believe these map to the various S&P sector indexes.
> The GICS classifications are described at
http://www.spglobal.com/gics.html.
> These descriptions almost duplicate the names of the S&P sectors.
>
> It also lists which of the 3 S&P major indexes (S&P 400, S&P 500, or S&P
> 600) the stock is a member of.
>
> Allan Wade
> Phoenix, AZ
> email: allanwade@xxxxxxxx
>
>  -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> On Behalf Of leo.timmermans.lt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2001 8:04 AM
> To: metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Sector analysis
>
>
> Hello,
>
> Does anybody know if the 10 major SP500 sector indices (utilities,
> telecommunications,...) have tickersymbols
> and can be downloaded from e.g. yahoo ??
>
> Kind regards
> Leo
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 08:40:17 -0700
> From: "Matthew R. Kratter" <mkratter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
>
> I wonder if anyone has any thoughts on the following system.
> Assuming one has the necessary capitalization and patience, would it work?
>
> Rules
>
> 1. Go long only.
> 2. Buy the front month Naz emini at 1800, 1700, 1600, 1500, 1400, etc. all
> the way down or all the way
> up!
> 3. Sell each contract only when it reaches a 100 point profit.
> 4. Rollover if necessary.
>
> Obviously if one had begun this strategy when the Naz was at 4000 or 5000,
> one would have a lot of
> still open positions.
> But given where we are now, doesn't the risk/reward seem reasonable?
>
> I seem to remember that a similar strategy was pursued with gold and
silver
> futures in the 1970's.
>
> Buying and holding the Naz emini has the advantages of diversification and
> leverage.  I know a lot of
> people
> who are playing a similar game with the QQQ's, but they don't have quite
the
> leverage.
>
> If the long, long term trend is NOT up, is this strategy still viable?
>
> Do you think that slippage from rollover's will have too great an impact?
>
> Best regards,
> Matthew Kratter
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 12:53:02 EDT
> From: CRLeBeau@xxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
>
> - --part1_75.177246e7.287f2fee_boundary
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>
> In a message dated 7/12/01 9:38:13 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> mkratter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx writes:
>
>
> > I wonder if anyone has any thoughts on the following system.
> > Assuming one has the necessary capitalization and patience, would it
work?
> >
> > Rules
> >
> > 1. Go long only.
> > 2. Buy the front month Naz emini at 1800, 1700, 1600, 1500, 1400, etc.
all
>
> > the way down or all the way
> > up!
> > 3. Sell each contract only when it reaches a 100 point profit.
> > 4. Rollover if necessary.
> >
> >
>
> This is a strategy widely known as "scale trading".
>
> It takes a lot of capital to make it work.  You also need to use "last
in -
> first out" accounting.
>
> The hidden danger is a prolonged down market where you wind up holding a
> huge
> position of big losers and run out of capital.  It also violates the
common
> axiom of "cut your losses and let your profits run".  This strategy holds
> losers forever and always takes small profits.
>
> It might work in particular circumstances but be careful about using this
> strategy on a regular basis.
>
> Chuck LeBeau
>
> - --part1_75.177246e7.287f2fee_boundary
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>
> <HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=2>In a message dated 7/12/01
> 9:38:13 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> <BR>mkratter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx writes:
> <BR>
> <BR>
> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid;
> MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">I wonder if anyone
> has any thoughts on the following system.
> <BR>Assuming one has the necessary capitalization and patience, would it
> work?
> <BR>
> <BR>Rules
> <BR>
> <BR>1. Go long only.
> <BR>2. Buy the front month Naz emini at 1800, 1700, 1600, 1500, 1400, etc.
> all
> <BR>the way down or all the way
> <BR>up!
> <BR>3. Sell each contract only when it reaches a 100 point profit.
> <BR>4. Rollover if necessary.
> <BR>
> <BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
> <BR>
> <BR>This is a strategy widely known as "scale trading".
> <BR>
> <BR>It takes a lot of capital to make it work. &nbsp;You also need to use
> "last in -
> <BR>first out" accounting.
> <BR>
> <BR>The hidden danger is a prolonged down market where you wind up holding
a
> huge
> <BR>position of big losers and run out of capital. &nbsp;It also violates
> the common
> <BR>axiom of "cut your losses and let your profits run". &nbsp;This
strategy
> holds
> <BR>losers forever and always takes small profits. &nbsp;
> <BR>
> <BR>It might work in particular circumstances but be careful about using
> this
> <BR>strategy on a regular basis.
> <BR>
> <BR>Chuck LeBeau</FONT></HTML>
>
> - --part1_75.177246e7.287f2fee_boundary--
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 13:01:05 -0400
> From: "John Manasco" <john@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
>
> - ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Matthew R. Kratter" <mkratter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2001 11:40 AM
> Subject: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
>
>
> > I wonder if anyone has any thoughts on the following system.
> > Assuming one has the necessary capitalization and patience, would it
work?
> >
> > Rules
> >
> > 1. Go long only.
> > 2. Buy the front month Naz emini at 1800, 1700, 1600, 1500, 1400, etc.
all
> the way down or all the way
> > up!
> > 3. Sell each contract only when it reaches a 100 point profit.
> > 4. Rollover if necessary.
> >
> > Obviously if one had begun this strategy when the Naz was at 4000 or
5000,
> one would have a lot of
> > still open positions.
>
> Sure if you have a several billion dollar capitalization because right now
> you would be holding on to a several billion dollar loss.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 10:44:35 -0700
> From: "Matthew R. Kratter" <mkratter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> - --------------216E7BF4796E1FAF11630D3B
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
> John,
>
> I was actually thinking of the Naz emini.
> If one starting going long at 4800, 4700, etc. and bought all the way
down,
> one would need a capitalization of $1,178,000 if we assume the NQ is
> currently
> at 1750 (see attached Excel spreadsheet)
> This obviously ignores rollover slippage and commissions,
> but it is a far cry from your "several billion dollars capitalization."
>
> I actively trade the Emini and have a capitalization much much less than
> this,
> so I am not about to follow this strategy.
> But I *am* interested in it as a thought experiment.  One could imagine
> doing
> the same thing with the QQQ's,
> buying 100 shares each time it goes down a point.
>
> Thanks to John and Chuck for their replies.
>
> Matt
>
> John Manasco wrote:
>
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Matthew R. Kratter" <mkratter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > To: <metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2001 11:40 AM
> > Subject: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
> >
> > > I wonder if anyone has any thoughts on the following system.
> > > Assuming one has the necessary capitalization and patience, would it
> work?
> > >
> > > Rules
> > >
> > > 1. Go long only.
> > > 2. Buy the front month Naz emini at 1800, 1700, 1600, 1500, 1400, etc.
> all
> > the way down or all the way
> > > up!
> > > 3. Sell each contract only when it reaches a 100 point profit.
> > > 4. Rollover if necessary.
> > >
> > > Obviously if one had begun this strategy when the Naz was at 4000 or
> 5000,
> > one would have a lot of
> > > still open positions.
> >
> > Sure if you have a several billion dollar capitalization because right
now
> > you would be holding on to a several billion dollar loss.
>
> - --------------216E7BF4796E1FAF11630D3B
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> - --------------216E7BF4796E1FAF11630D3B--
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 10:47:52 -0700
> From: "Matthew R. Kratter" <mkratter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
>
> - --------------4A051BBF55F12F900CBE9654
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
> Thanks for your reply, Chuck.
>
> How does one specify last-in-first-out accounting if one is doing all of
> the trades
> in the same futures account?  Do you know how one documents this for the
> IRS?
> Does it make a difference if one does it in different futures accounts?
> Thanks so much for taking
> the time to answer my questions!  I appreciate it.
>
> All the best
> Matt Kratter
>
> CRLeBeau@xxxxxxx wrote:
>
> > In a message dated 7/12/01 9:38:13 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> > mkratter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx writes:
> >
> >
> >
> >> I wonder if anyone has any thoughts on the following system.
> >> Assuming one has the necessary capitalization and patience, would it
> >> work?
> >>
> >> Rules
> >>
> >> 1. Go long only.
> >> 2. Buy the front month Naz emini at 1800, 1700, 1600, 1500, 1400,
> >> etc. all
> >> the way down or all the way
> >> up!
> >> 3. Sell each contract only when it reaches a 100 point profit.
> >> 4. Rollover if necessary.
> >>
> >
> > This is a strategy widely known as "scale trading".
> >
> > It takes a lot of capital to make it work.  You also need to use "last
> > in -
> > first out" accounting.
> >
> > The hidden danger is a prolonged down market where you wind up holding
> > a huge
> > position of big losers and run out of capital.  It also violates the
> > common
> > axiom of "cut your losses and let your profits run".  This strategy
> > holds
> > losers forever and always takes small profits.
> >
> > It might work in particular circumstances but be careful about using
> > this
> > strategy on a regular basis.
> >
> > Chuck LeBeau
>
> - --------------4A051BBF55F12F900CBE9654
> Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
> <!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
> <html>
> Thanks for your reply, Chuck.
> <p>How does one specify last-in-first-out accounting if one is doing all
> of the trades
> <br>in the same futures account?&nbsp; Do you know how one documents this
> for the IRS?
> <br>Does it make a difference if one does it in different futures
> accounts?&nbsp;
> Thanks so much for taking
> <br>the time to answer my questions!&nbsp; I appreciate it.
> <p>All the best
> <br>Matt Kratter
> <p>CRLeBeau@xxxxxxx wrote:
> <blockquote TYPE=CITE><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>In a
> message
> dated 7/12/01 9:38:13 AM Pacific Daylight Time,</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>mkratter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> writes:</font></font>
> <br>&nbsp;
> <br>&nbsp;
> <blockquote TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT:
> 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"><font
> face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>I
> wonder if anyone has any thoughts on the following system.</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>Assuming one has the
> necessary
> capitalization and patience, would it work?</font></font>
> <p><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>Rules</font></font>
> <p><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>1. Go long
only.</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>2. Buy the front month Naz
> emini at 1800, 1700, 1600, 1500, 1400, etc. all</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>the way down or all the
> way</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>up!</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>3. Sell each contract only
> when it reaches a 100 point profit.</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>4. Rollover if
> necessary.</font></font>
> <br>&nbsp;</blockquote>
>
> <p><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>This is a strategy widely
> known as "scale trading".</font></font>
> <p><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>It takes a lot of capital
> to make it work.&nbsp; You also need to use "last in -</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>first out"
> accounting.</font></font>
> <p><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>The hidden danger is a
> prolonged
> down market where you wind up holding a huge</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>position of big losers and
> run out of capital.&nbsp; It also violates the common</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>axiom of "cut your losses
> and let your profits run".&nbsp; This strategy holds</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>losers forever and always
> takes small profits.</font></font>
> <p><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>It might work in particular
> circumstances but be careful about using this</font></font>
> <br><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>strategy on a regular
> basis.</font></font>
> <p><font face="arial,helvetica"><font size=-1>Chuck
> LeBeau</font></font></blockquote>
> </html>
>
> - --------------4A051BBF55F12F900CBE9654--
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 20:15:30 +0200
> From: MikeSuesserott@xxxxxxxxxxx (MikeSuesserott)
> Subject: AW: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
>
> Hi Matthew,
>
> there is a book by R. Wiest, "You can't lose trading commodities", which
is
> about this strategy. You might also have a look at www.scaletrading.com.
>
> Not that I would advocate this type of trading - except perhaps as a
> spectator sport.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Michael Suesserott
>
>
> > -----Ursprungliche Nachricht-----
> > Von: owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > [mailto:owner-metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]Im Auftrag von Matthew R. Kratter
> > Gesendet: Thursday, July 12, 2001 17:40
> > An: metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Betreff: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
> >
> >
> > I wonder if anyone has any thoughts on the following system.
> > Assuming one has the necessary capitalization and patience, would it
work?
> >
> > Rules
> >
> > 1. Go long only.
> > 2. Buy the front month Naz emini at 1800, 1700, 1600, 1500, 1400,
> > etc. all the way down or all the way
> > up!
> > 3. Sell each contract only when it reaches a 100 point profit.
> > 4. Rollover if necessary.
> >
> > Obviously if one had begun this strategy when the Naz was at 4000
> > or 5000, one would have a lot of
> > still open positions.
> > But given where we are now, doesn't the risk/reward seem reasonable?
> >
> > I seem to remember that a similar strategy was pursued with gold
> > and silver futures in the 1970's.
> >
> > Buying and holding the Naz emini has the advantages of
> > diversification and leverage.  I know a lot of
> > people
> > who are playing a similar game with the QQQ's, but they don't
> > have quite the leverage.
> >
> > If the long, long term trend is NOT up, is this strategy still viable?
> >
> > Do you think that slippage from rollover's will have too great an
impact?
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Matthew Kratter
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 15:36:29 -0400
> From: "John Manasco" <john@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
>
> Matthew I obviously exaggerate but do I read your spreadsheet right where
it
> says the system has so far lost $961,000? I don't get it. I sometimes
scale
> into a position but I do it going up, not down. I'm not prepared to scale
> into pullbacks like the NAZ has had over the last two years.
>
> John Manasco
> - ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Matthew R. Kratter" <mkratter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2001 1:44 PM
> Subject: Re: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
>
>
> > John,
> >
> > I was actually thinking of the Naz emini.
> > If one starting going long at 4800, 4700, etc. and bought all the way
> down,
> > one would need a capitalization of $1,178,000 if we assume the NQ is
> currently
> > at 1750 (see attached Excel spreadsheet)
> > This obviously ignores rollover slippage and commissions,
> > but it is a far cry from your "several billion dollars capitalization."
> >
> > I actively trade the Emini and have a capitalization much much less than
> this,
> > so I am not about to follow this strategy.
> > But I *am* interested in it as a thought experiment.  One could imagine
> doing
> > the same thing with the QQQ's,
> > buying 100 shares each time it goes down a point.
> >
> > Thanks to John and Chuck for their replies.
> >
> > Matt
> >
> > John Manasco wrote:
> >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Matthew R. Kratter" <mkratter@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > To: <metastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2001 11:40 AM
> > > Subject: Naz 100 futures buy and hold system
> > >
> > > > I wonder if anyone has any thoughts on the following system.
> > > > Assuming one has the necessary capitalization and patience, would it
> work?
> > > >
> > > > Rules
> > > >
> > > > 1. Go long only.
> > > > 2. Buy the front month Naz emini at 1800, 1700, 1600, 1500, 1400,
etc.
> all
> > > the way down or all the way
> > > > up!
> > > > 3. Sell each contract only when it reaches a 100 point profit.
> > > > 4. Rollover if necessary.
> > > >
> > > > Obviously if one had begun this strategy when the Naz was at 4000 or
> 5000,
> > > one would have a lot of
> > > > still open positions.
> > >
> > > Sure if you have a several billion dollar capitalization because right
> now
> > > you would be holding on to a several billion dollar loss.
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of metastock-digest V1 #1385
> ********************************