An utter lack of context-sensitive help.
A need to make the "updated on-line reference" link functional.
Currently,
I'd bet that far less than 5% of these links provide "More
information:",
therefore one is soon conditioned to avoid the expected
disappointment.
Would it be feasible to update this link-portion of the
help file along with
the updated beta?
Bob
-----Original
Message-----
From: Tomasz Janeczko [mailto:amibroker@xxxxxx]
Sent:
Saturday, January 22, 2005 10:27 AM
To:
amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxSubject:
Re: [amibroker] Re: Training and/or User
Groups
Hello,
Thank you for your kind words.
Of
course there is a room for constant improvement. And it is being done,
step
by step, everyday.
There will be examples added to each and every AFL
function.
You may have noticed that all new functions (TimeFrame for
example)
come with examples already. Only some very old and pretty
basic
functions are without extensive examples (like sin() ) but
at the time I
wrote this it looked to me self-documenting.
In attempt to provide even
more examples, the AFL function reference
already features automatic
linking to code from AFL on-line library
showing usage of referred
function.
For example if you look at the reference to
HighestSince:
http://www.amibroker.com/guide/afl/afl_view.php?highestsinceyou
immediatelly get the list of formulas that use this function.
Moreover each
occurence of the function in question is automatically
highlighted. This
provides real-world example of usage of virtually
every AFL
function.
Best regards,
Tomasz Janeczko
amibroker.com
-----
Original Message -----
From: "tkoinaustin" <
tkoinaustin@xxxxxxxxx>
To:
<
amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent:
Saturday, January 22, 2005 6:59 PM
Subject: [amibroker] Re: Training and/or
User Groups
I have to agree with Tomasz. I had developed
and marketed a custom
piece of software for 10 years so I am familiar with
the issues of
customer expectations and satisfaction. I think Tomasz has
done a
good good on the manual. I have used the search engine repeatedly
and
found the information I need. I do agree that the one area
for
improvement would be concrete examples of how to use the
various
functions. There is so much capability in the program that I am
sure
very few people are actually using it effectively, and ceratinly
not
to it's fullest extent. This would be addressed, in great part,
by
more examples with explanations on what the various sections of
the
code are doing.
Tomasz, please do not take this as a dice. I
think your program and
documentation are outstanding. Think of this as an
area to excel! I
am essentially brand new to AB, and I could use more
examples, but in
lieu of that, this forum provides most of the info I
need.
Tom
--- In
amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Tomasz
Janeczko" <
amibroker@x...>
wrote:
>
Hello,
>
> While criticism is OK, I am pretty much surprised by
some
statements of yours.
> Your e-mail must come from the fact that
you do not know how to
> use tools already shipped with AmiBroker (like
HTMLHelp).
>
> Personally I find your e-mail pretty unfair
considering the amount
of
> work I have put into documenting
AmiBroker. Try writing 800+ pages
of docs
> (manual,
newsletters, how-tos) and preparing video tutorials and
then
> you
will get some idea about what "comprehensive
documentation"
means.
>
> 1. The manual *is* comprehensive. It
may not be structured to well
> but it covers simply every bit of
AB.
>
> 2. Compiler DOES locate the error and tells you what is
wrong.
> It gives you error line and character position and highlights
the
place
> where error occured.
> Actually it often gives you
much better and long explanations than
other languages.
> Such as
this one:
> "Error 3. Condition in IF, WHILE, FOR statements\nhas to be
Numeric
or Boolean type. You can not use array here,please use []
(array
> subscript operator) to access array elements"
>
>
This actually tells you WHAT YOU SHOULD DO in order to fix an error
> NO
OTHER compiler would tell you as detailed error message.
>
> The
only thing that need to be improved is that if error occurs
> inside
for/while loop then the compiler points you to the end of
the coding
block.
> This problem will be addressed but it is unfair to tell
that
compiler does not
> tell you what the problem
is.
>
> 3. Search in off-line mailing list archive
>
http://www.amibroker.com/listarchive.html>
>
is based on Microsoft full-text seach engine.
>
http://www.microsoft.com/mind/0297/htmlhelp.asp>
>
In Microsoft opinion it is the next best thing to sliced bread.
> If you
think it is bad, send complaint to Microsoft.
>
> The same applies
to search implemented in HTMLHelp
> User guide that is installed on your
computer.
>
> 4. Requiring "diagnostic ability of Visual C++
compiler" from AFL
> is ridiculous because of the following
> a)
AFL is for traders, not for programmers, so it offers
simple
> syntax without type declarations, prototypes,
templates, etc.
> b) AFL is not C++ (has no type declaration for example
and this
> itself 'removes' type checking for
example)
> c) AFL is not general-purpose language, does not
operate
> directly with machine code, does not have
direct access to
physical memory, etc.,
> so Visual
C++ tools like CPU view, memory dump view,
disassembly
window
> are useless.
> d)
AmiBroker is developed by 1 person, while Visual C++ is
developed by
thousands of people.
>
> 5. If you are "IBM programmer" - instead
of bashing other's work
like this,
> go on code your own trading
software that will be surely better and
write great comprehensive
manual
> and everybody will be happy including me.
>
> Best
regards,
> Tomasz Janeczko
> amibroker.com
> ----- Original
Message -----
> From: "Barry Scarborough" <
razzbarry@x...>
> To: <
amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>
Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2005 5:05 PM
> Subject: [amibroker] Re:
Training and/or User Groups
>
>
>
>
> We need a
comprehensive manual with well documented and coded
> examples with
comments on each line, the more the better. And we
> need a compiler
that locates the error and tells us what is wrong.
> Both of the current
items fall short of what we need to write
> effective code without
pulling our hair out.
>
> I do not agree with using weekly
subjects with examples within the
> context of the forum. Have you tried
to locate articles on the forum
> using search arguments? It is almost
impossible to find a specific
> topic and difficult at best to find what
you are looking for. A
> search returns many articles, then you have to
browse through them
> spending huge amounts of time and often coming
away more frustrated
> than when you began. Many of the example assume
you already know how
> to program within AB, bad assumption, and they
are not commented
> well at all. The more terse the example the more
difficult they are
> to follow. You can, and some often do, pack a lot
of code on one
> line and unless you understand the language and have a
block comment
> above the code telling you what is being done in human
language, you
> will not follow what is being done. Examples should not
do this.
>
> An online manual or a newer version in PDF that
allows searches
> would be good. How-to subjects with examples would be
much better
> than the manual we now have. The manual we now have often
provides
> links to examples on their website but they are not commented
well
> and many times are terse and very difficult for a newbie or even
a
> programmer to understand. Finding exactly what you are looking
for
> is very difficult. But that is what the forum is for. If the
same
> question is asked over and over then it is a candidate for an
online
> example withj comments. Examples should also have
meaningful
> variable names or good comments so they are easy to
follow.
>
> Another thing that would really be helpful is a
compiler that placed
> the cursor ON THE FAILING LINE with a good
explanation of what the
> failure is. I often, especially when I am
using for or if
> statements, I find an error at the end of the code
with the cursor
> on the last line of code and saying something like
"Hey you screwed
> up. He he. See if you can figure out where you made a
mistake." Many
> times I have had to comment out large blocks of code
trying to find
> out where the problem is. Then it is not always obvious
what the
> error is. A compiler that found all the errors, listed them
at the
> bottom with what the error definition is and allowing me to
click on
> that line and be taken to the error line would be much
better, but
> now we are talking about the diagnostic ability of a MS
Visual C++
> compiler. I double we will ever get that. But improvement
could be
> made.
>
> A comprehensive manual is what we need.
Allowing users to provide
> comprehensive well document examples would
be great too. Put them in
> a library on the AB site, not in the
forum.
>
> All the seminars I have attended, I am an IBM
programmer and have
> attended tons of them, addressed general topics,
unless they are
> weeks long. Newbies need a general, low level seminar
to get used to
> the code. People who have a fairly good grasp of the
language and
> how to use it would require a more comprehensive seminar,
actually a
> programming class that lasts a week or more. But when you
walk away
> from a seminar you had better have a comprehensive manual
because
> you are not going to remember what you were taught in a
month.
> Typically you lose 80% to 90% of what you are taught in three
months
> unless you start using it right away and keep at it. If you go
to a
> seminar and try to use what you learned a year later, forget it.
You
> will be looking in the manual.
>
> We also need a more
comprehensive description of how to use the
> Automatic Analysis tools,
back tester especially. I have not figuree
> out how to use them
effectively yet and I have been coding in AB for
> 1.5 years. Once
again, how do you set the settings? I still don't
> know how to set them
for a real world experience.
>
> Barry
>
> --- In
amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, CM
TOMSON <
chic195a@x...> wrote:
>
>
> > As a newbie I relate to requests for training. Attempting to
sort
> through 70 postings per day, in hopes of keeping abreast of
what
> problems lie ahead, and ways to head them off, coupled
with
> attempting to read a 600 page manual, is a challenge. I cringe
when
> an answer to a simple question is read the manual. I'm still in
the
> process of doing so, and it isn't that easy.
> >
>
> I have seen many suggestions about going to Clearwater, but
feel
> beginners would still be at a disadvantage, as well being
out
> airfare, and hotel rates.
> >
> > The
administrators and writers, and many participants are an
> educated and
sophisticated lot. My hats off to you, but even among
> you, the crème
of the crop, is patience tested. Novices always begin
> sentences with
the fact that they are new; it seems waiting for
> their lack of
knowledge to be challenged.
> >
> > I realize most of those
involved in amibroker are strained to the
> end. I also know that you're
tired of hearing questions if the
> manual already answers that.
However, as great as that manual is,
> perhaps there are lingering
doubts that if I experiment, and do what
> I think the manual suggests I
may actually create another problem
> that is not covered, or again ask
the same sophisticated people,
> another really stupid question on how
to get out of this or that.
> >
> > Is it possible therefore
to have a weekly subject with examples,
> and step-by-step procedures,
for a particular starter topic? The
> tutorials are fantastic, and I
don't mean that those instruments
> need be done, but a simple step by
step approach to a common
> denominator may avoid thousands of future
questions, and permit
> those of us who are less knowledgeable a chance
to catch up.
> >
> > The person who started this topic
stated he was at this a year,
> and still learning. This is a great
program, and its expansion and
> success, also lies in new people coming
in. Will these new people be
> willing to have patience for a year? If
new people come in and the
> program expands, and more and more
questions asked, and you have
> problems now, what happens then?
Will postings go from 70 to 200
> per day?
> >
>
>
> >
> > Respectfully submitted
> >
>
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
>
> Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second
Term'
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Check AmiBroker
web page at:
>
http://www.amibroker.com/>
>
Check group FAQ at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amibroker/files/groupfaq.html>
Yahoo! Groups Links
Check AmiBroker web page
at:
http://www.amibroker.com/Check
group FAQ at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amibroker/files/groupfaq.htmlYahoo!
Groups Links
Check AmiBroker
web page at:
http://www.amibroker.com/Check
group FAQ at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amibroker/files/groupfaq.htmlYahoo!
Groups Links
------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->
In low income
neighborhoods, 84% do not own computers.
At Network for Good, help bridge
the Digital Divide!
http://us.click.yahoo.com/EpW3eD/3MnJAA/cosFAA/GHeqlB/TM--------------------------------------------------------------------~->
Check AmiBroker web page at:
http://www.amibroker.com/Check
group FAQ at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amibroker/files/groupfaq.html
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go
to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amibroker/<*>
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
amibroker-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<*>
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ --
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG
Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.7.0 - Release Date:
1/17/2005