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Thanks Sid, this is all good stuff to know. I
have been doing Sched D by hand the last few years. It was getting out-of-hand
anyway, and now with 2 brokers, it is a good time to find a better way. I
have an OEM version of MS Money on my computer - I guess it is time to figure
out what I can do with it. Anyone find MS Money useful for this?
Steve
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 12:40
PM
Subject: Re: [amibroker] OT - Tax Q -
Sched D
FWIW...
I filed as a trader for several years
and was audited 3 different times. The IRS hates sch Cs that show all
expenses and no income. :(
Net score me 2, IRS 1, for a couple
hundred dollars.
I keep every individual tax lot in Quicken with
integrated downloads from several brokers and some lots entered
manually. I use Tax Cut for Fed and State taxes. I also never
found a CPA that was worth a damn.
With that as background, here is
what I do: I never fill out the sch D forms for individual trades, all I
enter is two summary lines with total buys, total sales, net profit/loss for
LT and ST and a note that details are available on request. The IRS
never had a problem with that. They have all the trade info from my
brokers anyway, and if there was a question on any individual trade I would
just supply documentation for that. They will want copies of the
confirmations in that case so the individual entries on the sch D are not used
anyway.
I have found if you keep complete records, treat it like
a real business and don't try to cheat, there is quite a bit of flexibility on
the part of the IRS when it comes to presentation on the tax
forms.
Still audits are a real PITA because of the time and effort
involved coming up with the documentation especially if you end up with a
poorly qualified examiner that is just trying to get through his day and wants
to cover his butt by appearing to be thorough.
Cheers
Sid
At
09:58 PM 6/27/2005, you wrote:
Hi Steve,
The short
answer: AFAIK, the IRS doesn't require you to list trades by brokerage, just
the list the individual trades with purchase amount (basis) and sale price
to show profit (loss) plus holding period and the total proceeds on the Sch
D. The Sch D is supposed to match the total from all Sch D-1s and the
1099s provided by your brokerage. That said, here's what I have been
doing for many years.
The longer answer: Years ago I
built my own Excel spreadsheet for tracking trades, partly to stay on top of
quarterly estimated tax payments and for Sch D purposes and partly to
monitor my trading (win-loss ratios, profitability, ROI, trade duration,
that sort of thing). The spread sheet has separate sheets for each
account and a summary collection sheet with linked cells for the gross and
net figures from each brokerage by quarter and end of year. So in many
ways, it functions like (what I understand) Gainskeeper does, just I have
more manual data entry (well, actually download and paste from the
brokerages), but more flexibility and info for my use.
But when I file, I reflect the summary totals of all accounts
on the Sch D, and complete as many Sch D-1 pages (I have used Turbo tax to
generate these) as necessary to list all my trades chronologically without
regard to what brokerage account they came from. Because I generally
have short positions held at year end (and I've not elected MTM status), I
always attach an explanation as to why the brokerage 1099 totals do not
match the total I am reporting (which is less). I note that I have
multiple brokerage accounts and multiple 1099s, that the figures on the Sch
D are the totals for all brokerage activity less the hold over short sales
which have not realized a gain or loss as of the end of the tax year and I
detail (format like a Sch D-1) the short positions that are open to show
that if their "sales" were added to my Sch D figures, the brokerage 1099's
and this figure would be in agreement. This letter also accounts for
any other matters that I think might raise a question and notes what
happened (e.g., multiple wash sales in one security, long term sales from
any of the investment accounts in a security I also traded, etc.). I used to
provide the spreadsheet with my tax return as well, but for the past 4 or 5
years I've simply stated in the letter that I also have an accounting for
all trades by brokerage, as well as confirm slips/monthly statements should
they be needed for review. I've never been asked for them (nor audited
for that matter - knock on wood), but then that may be a function of the
number of Sch D-1 pages I submit and the detail included in the rest of my
return on several Sch Cs (other businesses) and E's (partnerships, rental
properties) 2 Sch Fs (farming income) and other activities convinces
whomever that I can back up what I report. In any event, I don't try
to push the tax envelope either, I could probably deduct more items here and
there, but every thing is easily proven and I always keep an envelope of "Oh
what about these?" things each year in case I ever do get audited. I
have heard of folks who say they just provide the spreadsheet and the
summary on the Sch D, but what I've done seems to work and why mess with
something if it ain't broke.
And yes, I do my own returns (I
haven't found a CPA that adequately understood all the facets of my
activities). Suffice to say as well, I don't try to file
electronically. And for anyone reading, this isn't tax advice, get
your own lawyer, CPA or do your own research -- you're on your
own.
Peace and Justice
--- Patrick
- ----- Original Message -----
- From: Steve Dugas
- To: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 4:17 PM
- Subject: Re: [amibroker] TC2000/TCNet/TC2005 and QP
- Hi Patrick - a quick question if I
may:
- How do you reconcile Schedule D's when you
have multiple brokers? I have multiple accounts this year for the first
time. Both offer Gainskeeper ( free online version I guess ), but I am
wondering what is the best way to combine them into one Sched D. Thanks
very much!
- Steve
- ----- Original Message -----
- From: NW Trader
- To: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 2:00 AM
- Subject: Re: [amibroker] TC2000/TCNet/TC2005 and QP
- Hi Bob,
- It's been a while since we've exchanged many thoughts, I hope you
are well. What keeps you going back to QP?
- Actually I've had both for years, along with multiple RT feeds as
well. I'm sort of a belt and suspenders trader - most everything
is backed up or has an alternative (computers, data feeds, brokerages,
broadband and ISPs, even power with a generator system as I live in the
country). IMHO, they complement each other -- each with different
strengths and weaknesses. I'll try to summarize both.
- The Pros:
- QP has more fundamental fields exposed to AB in their API -- I
particularly like having float info (I still use a variant of the Rich
E's old PTATR for one exploration). And at least until recently (I
mark it more or less with Janene's departure), the stock data had fewer
errors and when it did was corrected quicker. Originally it ran
much faster in AB and as I first started with it, I had a predisposition
for it's scanning capability. If you use mutuals (I don't for timing or
otherwise), they are included with in a subscription.
- TC has intraday updates (I run several boxes while trading) albeit
delayed, so I if I wish, I can then quickly run AB AAs on an entire
database, not the several hundred at a time from eSignal. And they
have their media general groups (like the industry monitors in QP), but
listed within the sector so relative strength comparisons are much
easier than building and maintaining composites.
- The Cons:
- The QP data base (as I seem to recall you also complaining) is far
from clean -- I update my AB databases from the external ones each
weekend and then clean up inactive tickers -- QP generally has hundreds
whereas TC has a dozen or so. I've spoken often to tech support at
QP about this, and the are always "surprised" by the number (I've sent
them lists) and promise to look into it, but nothing changes and a new
disk (with a current database) doesn't change the bad tickers. [In
fact I spoke to them today again.] And while I don't use
mutuals funds, I understand that they often fail to account for
distributions and dividends promptly.
- When there is a data problem with TC, they can take weeks to correct
it. The program itself is something of a kludge of you are into
writing your own indicators, and of course you have to deal with the
idiosyncrasies of the Wordens (like, no ADX until just recently because
they didn't think it had merit, still no CCI, ATR, etc.). True,
with the most recent versions your can write your own custom indicators,
but ADX is not one of them and ATR is impossibly long (over 30 steps for
an ATR(10) ). And while there is some additional fundamental info
in their database, it isn't available via the API. Mutual funds
are an added subscription cost.
- The upshot:
- I'm in my 5th year with AB and long ago came to regard both TC and
QP as merely end of day data feeds for AB. If I could find another
data vendor that had the strengths of each, and perhaps not the
weaknesses, I'd switch and probably quit. I run my end of day
scans/exploration for watchlists on these databases (also verify data
integrity between the two), but for trading I'm watching the RT data
feeds - eSig, QuoteTracker fed by Prophet Finance, PCQuote, and
brokerage streamers. I had IQ feed for a while but found it was
too dirty and erratic. With the merger of Waterhouse and
Ameritrade, I'll probably close one account and open an IB account (when
Ameritrade got Datek, my account there got big enough and I added
eTrade). With whom are you trading, any thoughts or
recommendations?
- Best wishes, and good trades.
- Peace and Justice --- Patrick
- ----- Original Message -----
- From: Bob Jagow
- To: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Sent: Friday, June 24, 2005 7:41 PM
- Subject: RE: [amibroker] Re: New, fixed TC2000/TCNet/TC2005
data plugin
- I didn’t realize that you
used TC2000x, Patrick.
- Since I’ve tried it a few times, but always went back to QPlus,
could you spell out why you picked it, given that you also have a RT
feed?
- Regards,
- Bob
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